Author Topic: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes  (Read 473 times)

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Offline Dr DeEath

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Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« on: 12 September 2017, 02:02:46 PM »
I noticed this on the front page of a newspaper when I was buying Classic Bike in Smiths so brought a copy. After reading it I felt it was not totally accurate science and decided to delve a little deeper. It seems that the link may be more with processed meats, which are usually of the red type, than straightforward cuts of meat. This has also been linked with other health issues. I suspect that processed meats have changed considerably over the last century as the ingredients list now often reads like a chemistry lesson.

The advice to eat only chicken breast and fish would totally disrupt the food chain for a generation. I eat red meat about twice a week, usually as a lean steak or a Sunday roast. Fast food chain burgers are usually a last resort a few times a year. I do eat burgers at home but make my own so I know exactly what is in it - lean beef not rendered bits and pieces!   8)

What are your thoughts?
T1 for over 50 years.  MDI on Porcine insulin.  Lisinopril and Atorvastatin.

Offline Pattidevans

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #1 on: 12 September 2017, 02:12:15 PM »
Quote
What are your thoughts?

Do you really want to know?

Well then, they must do, because all of my adult life I have eaten bacon, salami and other cured meats such as Chorizo, Parma Ham, etc etc and guess?  I have T1.  On the other hand it could have been all that strong coffee.

My other thought is "absolute tosh"
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline Venomous

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #2 on: 12 September 2017, 02:40:57 PM »
I think they're trying desperately to sell newspapers and don't mind if their journalism is... fantastical.
T2 and PCOS. Just had large serous adenofibroma removed with ovary and fallopian tube. Bp is now normal!

Novorapid, levemir, trulicity, metformin.

Offline BBarb

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #3 on: 13 September 2017, 11:03:31 AM »
I also think its utter rubbish.  Remember all the humbug about eggs, and there was a salmonella in chicken scare too.  There are also pesticides in wheat, mould in oats, mad cow disease, mercury in fish, herbicides in vegetables, TB in milk ................ well we should soon all lose any excess weight if we listen to all this.

Offline nytquill17

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #4 on: 13 September 2017, 07:20:44 PM »
I think we are at a point with diabetes where we have a statistical problem. There are so many people out there with some form of diabetes or another that almost any behaviour or food choice can be found to be linked to diabetes if you don't have a thorough grasp of statistical analysis.

Of course proper research does exist, where you compare an experimental group to a control and you see that certain behaviours have a better-than-chance likelihood of leading to certain outcomes, in those cases we can properly talk about some kind of link, potentially (even then, there are often so many confounding variables when it comes to health - was it because they ate processed burgers specifically, or was it because those burgers are often eaten with fries and sugary drinks in a real-life environment?). But it's unethical to conduct that kind of research to look for disease causes, because it would mean that if you are right, you are expecting that at least some of your participants will develop diabetes as a direct result of having volunteered for your experiment...not a nice thing to do to them.

Anyway my point is that depending on how the claims are made in the research and reported in the journalism, it can often amount to something akin to those jokes about how "100% of people who have ever consumed chicken in their lifetimes eventually died from cardiac arrest." (Because medically speaking we all die from a stopped heart, it's the reason why the heart stopped that's different!)
T1 DX 1995
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Offline Alan

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #5 on: 13 September 2017, 11:27:04 PM »
I eat red meat often, including all three meals a day some days. I just finished breakfast: small steak, small hamburger, fried egg.

I have included red meat in at least half of my meals since the first year post diagnosis. The only effects on me have been good health and safe bood glucose levels.

Bacon and ham are the only processed meats I include regularly but occasionally my wife uses luncheon meat or berliner in my lunch sandwich.
Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia.
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Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.
There is nothing I could eat I like more than my eyes.
Type 2 Diabetes - A Personal Journey (latest: Small New York Baked Low Carb Cheesecake)
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Offline sedge

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #6 on: 14 September 2017, 12:48:12 AM »
Just come back from France where steak hache is freely available and is missed at home.  That's LEAN chopped beef, preformed into goodly sized oval burgers in all supermarkets and butchers.  You shave to buy the shallots separately and fry em in the same pan at the same time, otherwise you have a 2cm thick unflavoured burger on your plate!  The mustard (bought in England and transported by us) helps LOL
Jenny

T1 DX 1972, pumping Novorapid 24/05/11

HbA1c - 7/07 8.7, 1/08 7.8, 9/08 8.4, 3/09 7.3, 7/09 7.2, 12/09 7.3, 11/10 8.1, 2/11 8.6, 9/11 6.5 2/12 6.4  5/12 50/6.7  11/12 52/6.9  01/13 46/6.4  06/16 46/6.4  12/16 45/6.4

Offline Pattidevans

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #7 on: 14 September 2017, 09:25:50 AM »
Alan


What is Berliner?


Sedge


 How funny, we always buy our mustard on trips to France.  I am currently in my last jar of moutard a L'estragon.  One jar fell out of my friend's fridge whilst we were staying there as I did not realise the door shelf wasn't securely fastened in - naturally it broke and was a mess to clear up.  Works a treat in sauces etc...and as far as I know you cannot buy it here.


We were in Morrison's in Sunday, shopping to stock the freezer and they had 3 for £10 in meat/fish.  Julian pointed at one offering and said "what are those?"  "Those" were minced up chicken covered in breadcrumbs.  I replied "don't worry, we don't eat nasty things like that" and got a filthy look from another shopper who was just (unbeknown to me) placing a pack of them in her trolley beside me.
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline Paulines7

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #8 on: 14 September 2017, 10:45:28 AM »
We eat burgers but never from a "Take Away".  I like to know what the carb count is so only buy those from Supermarkets where I can read the packet to see what is in them.  I would never eat them with a bun either; I prefer to have them with fresh green vegetables. 

We never buy those minced up chicken things either.  I imagine everything goes into them including some bones, skin, claws etc.

The press do seem to sensationalize anything about diet and health, just to sell their papers.  I must admit that I have been taken in by them in the past when I have seen a headline about a cure for Alzheimer's, Diabetes or some other awful disease.   

Diabetes Type2 diagnosed March 2014.  Treated by diet only.  HbA1c 60 on diagnosis, 52 in June 2014, 50 October 2014, 44 December 2014, 48 May 2015, 50 Sep 2015, 53 Jan 2016, 50 Oct 2016, 56 Feb 2017, 50 Jun 2017. 50 Aug 2017.  Pacemaker fitted 2008.

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Offline Dr DeEath

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #9 on: 14 September 2017, 01:09:36 PM »

What is Berliner?


I am interested to hear because way back when JFK said "Ich bin ein Berliner" it did not mean he was a native if the city but that he was a doughnut. I can't imagine they form part of Alan's diet!

An interesting thought on the red meat issue is that we get numerous articles about the Mediterranean diet. Yet, typically, the Italians also eat salami, ham, etc. Like all things moderation is the key I believe.
T1 for over 50 years.  MDI on Porcine insulin.  Lisinopril and Atorvastatin.

Offline Alan

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #10 on: 14 September 2017, 01:50:17 PM »
Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia.
--
Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.
There is nothing I could eat I like more than my eyes.
Type 2 Diabetes - A Personal Journey (latest: Small New York Baked Low Carb Cheesecake)
Born Under a Wandering Star (Latest:Dambulla, Sigiriya and Polonuwarra, Sri Lanka)

Offline Pattidevans

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #11 on: 14 September 2017, 06:00:57 PM »
Oh yes, I recognise that sort of thing!
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline Liam

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #12 on: 14 September 2017, 06:37:14 PM »
Good to find out what it is. I'm sure I'd have classed it as a type of luncheon meat. I'll admit I buy the cheap stuff in Tesco and eat it as a snack if I'm ever hungry between meals. 
DX Type I 1994.    Novorapid Animas Vibe pump
HbA1c 3/10 10.2%, 7/10 8.1%, 12/10 7.5%.
2/11 7.8%, 8/11 8.6% 9/11 8.3%.
3/12 62 (7.8%). 10/12 67 (8.3%)
4/13 63 (7.9%) 6/13 59 (7.5%)
1/14 71 (8.6%) 7/14 59 (7.5%) 11/14 (6.7%)
3/15 56 (7.3%) 12/15 49 (6.6%)
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Offline sedge

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #13 on: 14 September 2017, 11:12:08 PM »
I HATE luncheon meat - used to dead a friend's mother ever offering me a Spam sandwich.  Oh thrice Yukkkk.

Re actual French mustard - I loathe tarragon (and all things aniseed eg chervil) so can't imagine I'd like that though Pete quite likely would.  My actual fave is English 'French' mustard - which is absolutely nothing at all like any moutard they vend en France.  Only available at Tescos now since Colmans ceased to make it - and I do also like Dijon - but it just isn't fiery enough for Pete and I don't eat enough of any kind to bother that much anyway.

However I do always use a goodly dollop of English (should be a teaspoon of actual mustard POWDER so it is QUITE a dollop of the ready made up variety) in cheese sauce, which defo suffers if you miss it out - no 'bite'  to it.
Jenny

T1 DX 1972, pumping Novorapid 24/05/11

HbA1c - 7/07 8.7, 1/08 7.8, 9/08 8.4, 3/09 7.3, 7/09 7.2, 12/09 7.3, 11/10 8.1, 2/11 8.6, 9/11 6.5 2/12 6.4  5/12 50/6.7  11/12 52/6.9  01/13 46/6.4  06/16 46/6.4  12/16 45/6.4

Offline Venomous

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Re: Now Red Meat Causes Diabetes
« Reply #14 on: 15 September 2017, 08:43:59 AM »
lol, I reminisce that spam is quite nice, especially fried if you're camping, though I haven't had it since childhood.

I do like big sliced salami and garlic sausage etc though.

Lots of our family are trying to persuade me back to vegetarianism, especially the vegans, but I do find it easier to control my meals with meat included.

English powdered mustard is fiery!!
T2 and PCOS. Just had large serous adenofibroma removed with ovary and fallopian tube. Bp is now normal!

Novorapid, levemir, trulicity, metformin.