Author Topic: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.  (Read 488 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Pattidevans

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 23,763
  • It's ONLY Diabetes. It could be something worse!
Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« on: 04 December 2017, 06:34:41 PM »
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1388245717311367

Should maybe have put this in the research section but I know many on here suffer from cramp but don't necessarily look in the research section.

I am still using a bar of soap in the bed and it helps enormously... but I find only Imperial Leather works for me.  Have just put a new bar in the bed and if nothing else the bed smells lovely and fresh!  I don't normally get the cramp in bed now, though I can suffer in the day sometimes.  Licking up a teaspoon of salt usually cures it but it tastes absolutely dire and makes me gag!
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline himtoo

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,547
  • Prince of Protein
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #1 on: 05 December 2017, 04:39:04 PM »
hi patti
this is a brand new one to me
I have never heard of this before.

Are you able to provide any kind of a brief overview in layman's terms
as to how these manifest , duration , what parts of the body etc etc.

I don't want to tell of my symptoms in case I am on a different wavelength to what you are reporting on.

many thanks !
p
T1 Dia Aug 1972 -pumping omnipod since 29/09/15  Losartan 100mg , simvastatin 40mg,Furosemide 40mg, Omeprazole 80mg , Doxazosin 8mg
Hba1c - 06/2013 6.1 02/2014 43(6.1) 07/14 42(6.0) 08/14 40( 5.8 ) 12/14 39 (5.7) 08/15 41 ( 5.9) 10/15 44 ( 6.2 ) 03/16 49 (6.6)
cholesterol --nov 2011 4.3 june 2012 4.4 June 2013 4.1 Feb 2014 4.1 dec 14 4.5 oct 15 4.4
Dafne grad. necrobiosis lipoidica on legs
laser treatment on both eyes 2002 and 2012, injections left eye 3 , wearing Noctura mask since oct 2014

Offline Pattidevans

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 23,763
  • It's ONLY Diabetes. It could be something worse!
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #2 on: 05 December 2017, 07:11:37 PM »
I haven't had time to really read the entire study Paul.  At the moment I am running round like a chicken with it's head cut off, putting up Christmas decorations, planning for a party and trying to make curtains in my "spare time".  Except today was taken up with setting up my new pump, visiting no less than 3 supermarkets (couldn't get Burgen bread or glucose tabs in the first two) and putting groceries away.

I used to often suffer night cramps in my legs and feet and I could wake screaming from them, barely able to move, though they have been much less severe since I found the soap trick.  In fact as long as I keep the soap fresh I hardly get them.
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline Pattidevans

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 23,763
  • It's ONLY Diabetes. It could be something worse!
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #3 on: 05 December 2017, 07:14:24 PM »
PS... it's the sort of thing Alan is good at interpreting.
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline Venomous

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,541
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #4 on: 05 December 2017, 08:23:54 PM »
Well I'd like someone cleverer than me to tell me what the study means as I get horrendous cramps (like that time when I felt the bones in my body were twisting it was so strong) and what it says will stop them!
T2 and PCOS. Just had large serous adenofibroma removed with ovary and fallopian tube. Bp is now normal!

Novorapid, levemir, trulicity, metformin.

Offline Alan

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,172
    • Type 2 Diabetes - A Personal Journey
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #5 on: 06 December 2017, 01:31:39 AM »
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1388245717311367

Should maybe have put this in the research section but I know many on here suffer from cramp but don't necessarily look in the research section.

I am still using a bar of soap in the bed and it helps enormously... but I find only Imperial Leather works for me.  Have just put a new bar in the bed and if nothing else the bed smells lovely and fresh!  I don't normally get the cramp in bed now, though I can suffer in the day sometimes.  Licking up a teaspoon of salt usually cures it but it tastes absolutely dire and makes me gag!

I haven't tried the bar of soap method yet. My night cramps are not as frequent nor as severe at the moment although I am woken two or three nights a week with foot and ankle cramps.

Give me some time to read and understand that study. At first glance it studied both types but suggests only T1 had a TCNS correlation with their cramps; it also notes T2 cramps were more frequent and more severe. But that is only a first glance.

They don't appear to offer any solutions.
Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia.
--
Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.
There is nothing I could eat I like more than my eyes.
Type 2 Diabetes - A Personal Journey (latest: Small New York Baked Low Carb Cheesecake)
Born Under a Wandering Star (Latest:Dambulla, Sigiriya and Polonuwarra, Sri Lanka)

Offline Pattidevans

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 23,763
  • It's ONLY Diabetes. It could be something worse!
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #6 on: 06 December 2017, 08:01:03 AM »
Thank you Alan, shall look forward to your understanding and explanation.  Not at all sure what TCNS means, nor the implications of motor nerve causes.
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline himtoo

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,547
  • Prince of Protein
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #7 on: 06 December 2017, 09:29:29 AM »
thanks -- that is a bit better understanding now.

so , these cramps are normally to be found only while in bed ?

what is the action of the soap ? does it provide a chemical reaction ?

T1 Dia Aug 1972 -pumping omnipod since 29/09/15  Losartan 100mg , simvastatin 40mg,Furosemide 40mg, Omeprazole 80mg , Doxazosin 8mg
Hba1c - 06/2013 6.1 02/2014 43(6.1) 07/14 42(6.0) 08/14 40( 5.8 ) 12/14 39 (5.7) 08/15 41 ( 5.9) 10/15 44 ( 6.2 ) 03/16 49 (6.6)
cholesterol --nov 2011 4.3 june 2012 4.4 June 2013 4.1 Feb 2014 4.1 dec 14 4.5 oct 15 4.4
Dafne grad. necrobiosis lipoidica on legs
laser treatment on both eyes 2002 and 2012, injections left eye 3 , wearing Noctura mask since oct 2014

Offline Pattidevans

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 23,763
  • It's ONLY Diabetes. It could be something worse!
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #8 on: 06 December 2017, 09:58:36 AM »
Paul

I occasionally get cramp in my foot at other times. 

Re: soap.  You need to google it, but here's a page which suggests it's some molecule in the fragrance which is the thing that keeps cramp at bay.  I find that Imperial Leather has a strong scent and works well for me.  Have tried other so called "scented" soap where the aroma hasn't been so obvious and it's not worked.  Once the soap dries out it needs replacing too.

When are your cramps?
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline himtoo

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,547
  • Prince of Protein
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #9 on: 06 December 2017, 11:55:17 PM »
I tend to only get them if I bend my leg when sitting in my computer chair ( like bending over to reach the printer under the desk etc )

and it is always thigh muscles that cramp
so not sure if it is the same thing.

I have mentioned this to Di ( as she sometimes gets cramps in bed -- we will be trying out the soap soon.
T1 Dia Aug 1972 -pumping omnipod since 29/09/15  Losartan 100mg , simvastatin 40mg,Furosemide 40mg, Omeprazole 80mg , Doxazosin 8mg
Hba1c - 06/2013 6.1 02/2014 43(6.1) 07/14 42(6.0) 08/14 40( 5.8 ) 12/14 39 (5.7) 08/15 41 ( 5.9) 10/15 44 ( 6.2 ) 03/16 49 (6.6)
cholesterol --nov 2011 4.3 june 2012 4.4 June 2013 4.1 Feb 2014 4.1 dec 14 4.5 oct 15 4.4
Dafne grad. necrobiosis lipoidica on legs
laser treatment on both eyes 2002 and 2012, injections left eye 3 , wearing Noctura mask since oct 2014

Offline Pattidevans

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 23,763
  • It's ONLY Diabetes. It could be something worse!
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #10 on: 07 December 2017, 10:08:06 AM »
It might help Di’s cramps, but as you don’t get them in bed I doubt it’s influence will extend to you Paul :P
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline Quantum Learning

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,247
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #11 on: 07 December 2017, 11:10:45 AM »
Quote
and it is always thigh muscles that cramp
so not sure if it is the same thing.

OH had terrible trouble with cramps in both thigh muscles and inability to build any. Greatly improved since loading with B12. The doc at the B12 charity advised him not to wait for the NHS injections but to start injections himself at home immediately. He still injects 5ml himself every month on top of the NHS's paltry 1ml every 3 months. It took 4 months to repair the damage from having been too low for too long but suddenly, no more thigh cramps.  :)
Type 2 dx Nov 2012 with fasting BG 14%/129.5
HbA1c Jan 2013 79/9.3%
April 2013 50/6.7%
July 2013 39/5.7%
Oct 2013 39/5.7% Chol 5.9
July 2014 45/6.3% Chol 5.5
Aug 2015 61/7.7% Chol 5.9
May 2016 84/9.7% Chol 6.9
Oct 2016 53/7%  Chol 6.3
Dec 2016 41/5.9% Chol 6.0
June 2017 51/6.8% Chol 6.1
Oct 2017 52/6.9% Chol
Metformin SR 2000mg, Doxazosin 1mg, Omeprazole 20mg, Fexofenadine 180mg Co-Codamol 30/500g when needed. Amitriptyline 20mg
Toujeo/NovoRapid, Allergic to Levemir.

Offline Pattidevans

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 23,763
  • It's ONLY Diabetes. It could be something worse!
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #12 on: 07 December 2017, 12:09:04 PM »
Well now, that is very interesting Q.  Where do you get the B12 injections?
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans

Offline Quantum Learning

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,247
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #13 on: 07 December 2017, 05:34:25 PM »
He spoke to the doc at the B12 charity and when he told him his blood test results he told him to get his own B12 & start injecting straight away, while waiting for his appt for the NHS one, it still took 4 months for his body to recover from the damage caused by being so low but then saw an improvement and he's able to cycle again.

I'm quite happy to post a link to the co. he bought the B12 & syringes etc if that's allowed?

The charity is: http://www.b12d.org/  Dr Chandy was very helpful and was willing to talk on the phone for ages. I believe he left the medical profession as they objected to him treating his patients with high doses of B12 and actually curing them.

Let me know if you want details of the co. he bought the stuff from, don't want to break any forum rules  ;)
Type 2 dx Nov 2012 with fasting BG 14%/129.5
HbA1c Jan 2013 79/9.3%
April 2013 50/6.7%
July 2013 39/5.7%
Oct 2013 39/5.7% Chol 5.9
July 2014 45/6.3% Chol 5.5
Aug 2015 61/7.7% Chol 5.9
May 2016 84/9.7% Chol 6.9
Oct 2016 53/7%  Chol 6.3
Dec 2016 41/5.9% Chol 6.0
June 2017 51/6.8% Chol 6.1
Oct 2017 52/6.9% Chol
Metformin SR 2000mg, Doxazosin 1mg, Omeprazole 20mg, Fexofenadine 180mg Co-Codamol 30/500g when needed. Amitriptyline 20mg
Toujeo/NovoRapid, Allergic to Levemir.

Offline Pattidevans

  • Administrator
  • Posts: 23,763
  • It's ONLY Diabetes. It could be something worse!
Re: Very interesting study on muscle cramps and diabetes.
« Reply #14 on: 07 December 2017, 09:45:28 PM »
I think on this occasion Q we would like the link to where to buy the stuff.  It's clearly requested by a bona fide member and not a spam post.
Patti


Type 1.  Mis-diagnosed T2 May 2003, finally had CPeptide test 15/7/11 and proper diagnosis 1/9/11.  Now pumping Apidra with Roche Spirit Combo pump. Hba1c 6.1 April 2016.


© 2015 Patti Evans